Audio file 57-1

Ernest speaks about initially wanting to be a journalist, even as he was making the "African Madonna" (1929)

In 1929, when Ernest carved "African Madonna" aka "Black Madonna" he was a teacher at Grace Dieu Diocesan College

Ernest gossips about an incident at the University of Fort Hare

Wonga asks about Ernest's Afrikaaner education - digressions about the politics of the language and Ernest's cousin Elliot - Ernest confirms he is not fluent

Afrikaans is a South African language whose roots are the Dutch language intermixed with Malay and African languages

[tape stopped and restarts, twice] Ernest speaks of the Head of the University of Fort Hare, Kerr, telling the students about African slaves; they speak about slavery

They speak of Kerr and the history of the University of Fort Hare [mentions Jabavu]

Ernest speaks of Professor Lyle, who taught biology, how she taught not just the subject but also to respect life and which had an impact on him

Wonga speaks of ethics in science [mentions Dr Mengele, Einstein, Dr Testa, Luc Ferry]

Wonga returns to the women teachers at the University of Fort Hare

[tape ends]