Audio file 66-2

[continued from 66-1] Wonga asks about the studios of the occupants in Alberto Giacometti's artistic complex in Paris - Diego Giacometti's, Tonio Pototschnig's

Ernest describes Tonio Pototschnig as the caretaker of the Giacometti complex

Ernest and Wonga speak of Tonio Pototschnig, an Austrian who was also incarcerated during World War II in Germany but returned to Paris after the war

Ernest agrees that Pototschnig's death was important to him and Alberto Giacometti - Wonga refers to Giacometti's text about a dead man and wonders if it's Pototschnig?

Ernest explains how he and Giacometti came to cleanse the dead man's body; Ernest mentions it was at the request of the deceased's wife who approached Giacometti who approached Ernest to assist him

Whilst Pototschnig was married, it is more likely his mistress, Renée Alexis, who approached Giacometti (according to James Lord, Giacometti's biographer)

They try to remember where Pototschnig was buried, they think Montrouge Cemetary; Wonga tries to understand the importance of the death to Giacometti, Ernest concurs with Wonga

Ernest explains death in South African tradition

Wonga reminds Ernest of seeing corpses used for anatomy lessons treated as objects when he visited his friend, Dr Ngomo, in England

Dr Ngomo was a fellow student at the University of Fort Hare who went to England to study medicine. In Ernest's 1938-1940 diary, there is an entry of visiting him

Wonga tries to recall the title of the text that Giacometti wrote about the death; Wonga refers to Homer's writing about the burial of Hector

It is probably "The Dream, the Sphinx and the Death of T." which Giacometti wrote for the art journal "Labyrinthe" in 1946

[tape stopped and restarted] Wonga speaks about a neighbour, Colonel de la Rocque, whom Wonga calls "Croix-de-Feu" for he started the ultra nationalist league of that name

[tape stopped and restarted] they are looking at a sketch plan of Giacometti's complex which was at the corner of Rue Hippolyte Maindron and Rue du Moulin Vert, and trying to place the occupants' studios' location (mentioning Alberto Giacometti, Diego Giacometti and Sonja Ferlov Mancoba)

Giacometti's complex was on the corner of the 2 streets and had 2 separate entrances. The architecture has since changed from Giacometti's time.

[tape stopped and restarted] Wonga returns to the politics of Colonel de la Rocque and the league Croix-de-Feu; they speak about nationalism (mentioning Winston Churchill, Philippe Pétain)

Wonga speaks of the intelligentsia's anti-semitism and whether their defence of being writers was legitimate (mentions Louis Aragon)

[tape ends]